@jwildeboer With KSA chairing the Human Rights Commission?
@jwildeboer Also to be clear that my concern is _not_ hypothetical:
@dredmorbius and I’m on your side. So let’s move onward. Find better solutions. Expose the failures. Iterate. Look forward.
@jwildeboer So, a couple of approaches I try to use:
1. Establish common ground or agreement.
2. Identify concerns or disagreeent.
3. Seek to expand 1 and shrink 2.
@jwildeboer A first question might be:
What problem are you trying to solve?
E.g., what's wrong with present systems? What do you want to do?
@dredmorbius I’ve said that in this very thread three times. We. Need. Global. Governance. For. Global. Problems. And our current systems do not deliver, as you pointed out. So. What’s next?
@penguin42 @jwildeboer @dredmorbius indeed. yes. philisophical hypothetical: what if there were a magical oracle that could tell you exactly what the best global solution to a problem is, infallibly, and the oracle said “dictatorship with tight speech controls”, would you accept it as the correct answer? how would you react?
@zensaiyuki @penguin42 @jwildeboer @dredmorbius how could you possibly know if the oracle is correct? Either it's simple faith, in which case this is no different from declaring a global caliphate, or it's possible to check the oracle's answer without doing what they say, meaning that you already have a way to prove that it's the best solution and you would have checked that anyway.
@zensaiyuki @penguin42 @jwildeboer @dredmorbius additionally, if something I find intolerable is the answer to a problem, then I would say that the issue lies with the statement of the problem and parameters. There's always at least one global maximum given any parameters, such as "keep personal freedom and whatnot"
@zensaiyuki @penguin42 @jwildeboer @dredmorbius Who said I never doubted my self? You're missing the point of my argument: I do not doubt that, with improperly constrained parameters, the oracle might tell me objective truth that I dislike. But since I can constrain my parameters to take into account my judgement, that is not an issue.
@zardoz I don't _consciously_ seek power over others, as a rule.
I've increasingly found myself in irreconcilable conflict with others over matters in which there is apparently no common ground. It's distressing. I find I ultimately have to act in my own interests even where I'm aware my counterparty will be harmed, as they 1) leave no option and 2) will exercise the same behaviour over me.
Well, there is an option, but it would be complete capitulation.
Generalistic and moderated instance.