I have a feeling that the FLOSS movement in spirit was constructed in the previous centralised computing paradigm with timesharing systems, and in some sense is left there. I wonder what its corresponding movement of our time would be, now that the pendulum has swung back from the desktop computing paradigm and into dumb terminals over a document format?

@alcinnz I think so, but not just that. If they used copyright law and GPL, I think we need to do similar forays into other fields, but I'm still quite fuzzy on the details of what that means.

@albin Well, Stallman, Maciej Cegłowski, later @aral , etc have talked about the concept of a General Data Minimisation Regulation (Aral's term).

I do think we should be campaigning for that. I don't know what else.

@alcinnz Without having read anything about it, it sounds reasonable to me!

@albin I'll look up some articals for you, but the idea is that if you can do your core job without uploading a piece of data to some central servers you are forbidden from doing so. And you can't say "but we can offer more conveniences by collecting this data".

@albin From Stallman's artical:

"There are so many ways to use data to hurt people that the only safe database is the one that was never collected. Thus, instead of the EU’s approach of mainly regulating how personal data may be used (in its General Data Protection Regulation or GDPR), I propose a law to stop systems from collecting personal data."

@alcinnz @albin this is a libertarian fantasy. Data has power for good and evil it's a choice and has been since we invented numbers and writing.


I'm not sure exactly a libertarian fantasy, but its certainly one that is definately pro individualisation

if you look and follow the logic to its extreme- dont store or share any data, you end up with something that could be called hyper individualization, something that maybe wouldnt be life?

Dont most interactions, between, not just humans, but any two given organisms, require some kind of exchange of 'data'

Life is a lot about connections and sharing

@alcinnz @albin

@dazinism @Hamishcampbell @albin Sure if you take it to the extreme, but that's not what I'm talking about. Because today we're at an opposite extreme.

@alcinnz @dazinism @Hamishcampbell I would be open to this move as pure strategy as well; as a potential means to stymie corporate growth and create a breathing space. In that case, the question becomes how to avoid that strategy backfiring or being circumvented?

@albin @alcinnz @dazinism @Hamishcampbell

This is definitely not a cure-all, or even a proposal, but is anything happening about licenses for data similar to licenses for software? I know, creative commons, but I am thinking about your personal data that accompanies your online activities of all kinds.

Like, there are good uses for open data in science etc. And then bad uses...

@bhaugen I'm not specifically aware of data licenses, though CC tends in that direction.

Data and code are both covered by copyright, so copyright-based language ... is at least a start.

I'd argue that there's additional components to personal data, especially in bulk, which _aren't_ adequately addressed by copyright. But then, you could say the same of software, and GPL, et al, have worked fairly well.

@albin @alcinnz @dazinism @Hamishcampbell


I think somewhere in Holochain a conversation about licenses to data on the chains is going on.

Or at least conversations about who can access what in an agent-centric network. E.g. how an agent can specify who can see what under what conditions.

@albin @alcinnz @dazinism @Hamishcampbell

@bhaugen @dredmorbius @albin @dazinism @Hamishcampbell

Oh, maybe you can clarify something for me:

I've repeatedly heard that copyright doesn't cover the facts you communicate, just how you choose to express them. So how do data licenses fit in with that?

@bhaugen Compilations of information may be covered by copyright. Enough so that present practices become legally ambiguous, and hence risky.

But yes, this is a limitation of copyright, and an argument for new legal doctrines.

@albin @alcinnz @dazinism @Hamishcampbell

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